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Episode 133  |  26:37 min

#122: The 11 Books We Keep In The Drift Lobby For Everyone

Episode 133  |  26:37 min  |  06.01.2018

#122: The 11 Books We Keep In The Drift Lobby For Everyone

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This is a podcast episode titled, #122: The 11 Books We Keep In The Drift Lobby For Everyone. The summary for this episode is: Finally. The first podcast live from the new Drift office in downtown Boston. If you come by, you'll notice there are multiple copies of 11 particular books in the lobby that anyone can take. On this episode of Seeking Wisdom, DC & DG breakdown the books and the story behind each one. Get your reading list ready. PS. Stay tuned for a HUGE announcement for HYPERGROWTH next week -- don't forget to get your tickets at hypergrowth.drift.com with the promo code SEEKINGWISDOM to save $500 today. Tweet at us @davegerhardt and @dcancel.
Finally. The first podcast live from the new Drift office in downtown Boston. If you come by, you'll notice there are multiple copies of 11 particular books in the lobby that anyone can take. On this episode of Seeking Wisdom, DC & DG breakdown the books and the story behind each one. Get your reading list ready. PS. Stay tuned for a HUGE announcement for HYPERGROWTH next week -- don't forget to get your tickets at hypergrowth.drift.com with the promo code SEEKINGWISDOM to save $500 today. Tweet at us @davegerhardt and @dcancel.

DG: We're on.

David Cancel: We're on. We're back. We're in the new studio here. So my name is David Cancel, otherwise known as the Uncle, otherwise known as DC, otherwise known as OG, that stands for old guy.

DG: Old guy.

David Cancel: On my right over here in the brand new studio, we have, introduced yourself.

DG: I'm DG, AKA, the Nephew is what they call me. I'm Dave also. Somebody kept calling me. So like Joel Barna, every time I see him in the hallway, he's like, " What up DV?" I'm like, no.

David Cancel: You're DG.

DG: I'm DG.

David Cancel: Damn, that's cold.

DG: So I told him I won't talk to him until he says it right.

David Cancel: Until he gets the name right? All right.

DG: So yeah. I'm excited, man. We're in this new studio. It's going to be something. I think though, you secretly love this because this is very like Bezos.

David Cancel: Yeah. We're on a folding table.

DG: The folding table. But I heard that there's going to be a green screen.

David Cancel: No green screen. There's going to be something, not a green screen.

DG: Not a green screen.

David Cancel: Going to be something else.

DG: Some real things.

David Cancel: DG only knows green screens.

DG: I only know green screen. I'm not the geared.

David Cancel: He keeps saying everything is green screen.

DG: Everything's a green screen. What does it matter? It's a green screen. It's going to be a green screen back here.

David Cancel: No, it's going to be a black screen. No green screen. So you're listening to Seeking Wisdom.

DG: Yes.

David Cancel: The internet's hottest podcast.

DG: It's the internet's favorite podcast.

David Cancel: Favorite podcast with the most six star reviews. This is a fact.

DG: This is a fact.

David Cancel: This podcast has the most six star reviews of any podcast on the planet. Go check it for yourself.

DG: Check it out.

David Cancel: While you're there, leave a six star review.

DG: Yeah. So I love it. I love the intro. I love the teeing up. I actually just got a Apple Connect podcast, whatever it is. So we can get under the hood of the podcast. When I was in there, I didn't see anything about six stars. So we don't get credit for that.

David Cancel: We should get credit.

DG: Yeah, we should get it.

David Cancel: Someone call Apple.

DG: We should get credit for that.

David Cancel: What are we talking about, nephew?

DG: We have so much to talk about. You know what I realized? I was just thinking about what do I want to talk about today? I could just go to your Twitter feed and read a tweet and ask you to just... That could be its own podcast.

David Cancel: Are you picking up on the sub tweet?

DG: Oh, I have the filter. When you sub tweet, I only get it. I know them all. I know them all, sub tweet. I know them. Whether it's about me or somebody, I always know. I always know. It's never about me. I know what they are. I have a bunch of things I want to talk to you about today.

David Cancel: Okay. Shoot.

DG: So actually I want to talk to you about a couple of things from the new office. We moved into this new office. Okay. You didn't let me see it. I didn't get to come here. I didn't get to see it.

David Cancel: No one did.

DG: It was a surprise. Nobody saw it. Although I heard a couple of people came over. They got in trouble because they came over a little early.

David Cancel: They snuck over, sales guys. We know who you are. We have your name on a list.

DG: So a couple of interesting things I want you to talk about. When I walked in the office the first time one thing stood out to me. Books in the lobby. Okay. I walked in the lobby and I see all these books in the lobby of our office. If you come, when you come, maybe you're going to come work at Drift one day, maybe become a Drift customer, hang out in the lounge. One thing that stood out-

David Cancel: Was the lounge?

DG: The lounge.

David Cancel: That's right, we have a customer lounge.

DG: Customer lounge.

David Cancel: So we have this philosophy that every Drift office around the world will have a customer lounge, dedicated area, and it's going to be swank. We'll send out some pictures and stuff. Anyone who's a Drift customer can come work out of our office. Hang out with us.

DG: Free.

David Cancel: Get free wifi. Get free snacks, cookies, coffee, swags, sweatshirts, hats, scarves, shoes, socks.

DG: Free wifi, free hospitality.

David Cancel: We don't have pants yet, someday we'll get pants.

DG: Some joggers.

David Cancel: Yeah. Get joggers.

DG: So not only do you have a customer lounge, which you will have, but there was 11 books. There's 11 books out there. I don't know if you counted, I counted them.

David Cancel: I did not.

DG: There's 11 books out there. Where there's like three to seven copies of each one.

David Cancel: Yep.

DG: Okay. I feel like these were all strategically picked. So what I'm going to do is since this podcast is always about learning, we're going to accelerate everybody's learning today. I'm going to tell you the books that are in our lobby.

David Cancel: Okay. Go for it.

DG: I want you to tell me why.

David Cancel: For each one.

DG: I want you to tell me why for each one. Okay. I'm going to start from the bottom up. Number one is Essential Drucker, Peter Drucker.

David Cancel: The OG.

DG: The OG.

David Cancel: That's the real OG. I'm the pretend OG. So Peter Drucker, plenty of books. One of the other books that we always recommend is called Managing Oneself, also Peter Drucker book. Hard to pick from his extensive library of quality. I was on a webinar recently and I was telling them that everything that you need to learn in business is in a Peter Drucker book somewhere.

DG: It was written in like 1940.

David Cancel: Yeah. So it's old school.

DG: Essential Drucker, all of his lessons in one book.

David Cancel: Yeah. So all of his lessons in one book. If you walk in, the idea when you come into the Drift office, as a customer, as someone who's interviewing, as a friend, you can just come hang with the crew.

DG: You're going to give people those books.

David Cancel: Yes. Those books are there for people to take. Not only are those books there, but every one of our conference rooms is named after an author who's had a big impact on us. When you walk into the room that's named after that author, there's also a stack of books and there will be a little card that says," Please welcome yourself to a copy of one of these books."

DG: I love that. I had two meetings today, even though we don't have meetings here at Drift, I had two meetings today. One of them was in Ogilvy.

David Cancel: Yep.

DG: The other one was in, shit, I forgot. I forgot what it was. There's so many now. I found out there's a whole wing of conference rooms.

David Cancel: 18.

DG: There's so many. Maybe it was Hastings. But no, do we have a Hastings? We do.

David Cancel: I don't think we have a Hastings.

DG: I'm just making it up.

David Cancel: We have a McCord.

DG: We have a McCord. That's who it was. Patty McCord. Shout out Patty McCord. That's why I thought Netflix, Reed Hastings, Patty McCord. It was in McCord. Okay. So Essential Drucker's number one. Number two, Radical Candor.

David Cancel: Radical Candor.

DG: Kim Scott.

David Cancel: Kim Scott. What's up, Kim?

DG: This book will change your life as a manager, or as anybody inside of a company.

David Cancel: So I heard about Kim Scott from a long time ago. She worked for Sheryl Sandberg at Google. She also worked at Apple and she launched the Apple University, which is what is used by Apple to train all of their retail and regular employees. So it was this big undertaking that they did. They built the university system inside of it. She took the lessons that she learned from those companies and some companies that she founded before that didn't go as well, and put them into this book called Radical Candor. It's a book that we give out to everyone here who manages people. Basically what it teaches you in this book is how to give that radical feedback. How to give that radical candor when you're giving feedback. Because one of the things that often happens for all managers, no matter how senior or junior they are, is that they want to be liked. Everyone wants to be liked. So they don't give the feedback that is critical, that they need to give. Instead, they give the attaboys, the you did a good job. They basically just blow smoke because they want you to feel good. Nobody wants to make you feel uncomfortable. But by doing that, what they're doing is they're undermining.

DG: Nobody's growing.

David Cancel: No one is growing. They're sending those people up to fail. So the way that Kim frames it is so much better than I've been able to frame it, which is-

DG: Radical Candor.

David Cancel: Radical Candor. You have to do that. If you really care about someone, you're going to give them the feedback that they need.

DG: I was just looking back, I'm going to pull a DC and quote one of my tweets.

David Cancel: What? A quote?

DG: Last Friday, I said, I tweeted," The hardest part about joining Drift is that you often get real feedback for the first time in your career." I think that's true.

David Cancel: Amen.

DG: I think that's true. A lot of people think they get feedback.

David Cancel: No.

DG: But it's like," I really like this. Now here's one thing you should change." If you don't like it, say it and it's going to help. Nobody's going to get offended by it. You can talk to me in the hallway after, and I'm not mad at you. It's just real feedback. Okay.

David Cancel: This is good education for our new man here who's sitting in. You haven't seen him. We've got this new wizard here.

DG: Wow.

David Cancel: His name is G2.

DG: G2.

David Cancel: G2 Gonzalo.

DG: Shout him out when you leave a six star review after this episode.

David Cancel: Yeah. Gonzalo.

DG: Shout him out.

David Cancel: Taking video to a next level here at Drift.

DG: I don't want to put him on the spot, but I didn't expect him to ship as many videos as fast as he is doing.

David Cancel: He's setting the pace. He's setting the pace.

DG: He knows how to make-

David Cancel: Has me smiling.

DG: Knows how to make the old guy smile.

David Cancel: Yeah, I'm smiling.

DG: OG smile. Okay. So Essential Drucker, Radical Candor. The Advantage, Patrick Lencioni.

David Cancel: Yes. Patrick has again, a bunch of great books that you should dive deep into Patrick's library. Like the 12 Dysfunction. I think it's called the 12 Dysfunctions of a Team. I might get the number wrong there, it might be the Seven Dysfunctions. But anyway, he's got a bunch of books and what's great about Patrick is that he writes business books using fables. So using storytelling to get his point across. I find that his books resonate with so many people because they use this framework of storytelling because we all to listen to stories. The advantage is it basically puts together his system for that he's learned over all of these companies and writing these books, about how to implement a management system within a company.

DG: Love it. Okay. Next one, one of my favorites, any guesses? Give me a guess? I mean, they're all going to be on my list.

David Cancel: They're all.

DG: All right. Behind the Cloud.

David Cancel: All right. Behind the Cloud.

DG: Mark Benioff, Behind the Cloud.

David Cancel: Mark Benioff. I'm watching you, Mark.

DG: The story behind Salesforce.

David Cancel: The story about-

DG: Very nice building in San Francisco.

David Cancel: Very nice building, giant building that they're building over there, soon to be called Drift Tower One.

DG: It's a lovely place.

David Cancel: Yeah. Drift Tower One.

DG: Behind the Cloud.

David Cancel: Behind the Cloud. So this is a great book by a master promoter, master brand marketer. That's so rare.

DG: The best, the best.

David Cancel: Because especially coming from B2B, which we don't have a lot of good brand marketers in there. So this is the story of the founding of a billion dollar company at the time. They're probably like a 90 billion dollar market cap company at this point and our number one enemy, but I give respect.

DG: Whoops.

David Cancel: Whoops. So I give respect to him. This is a great book. You got to study it. Almost like Jeff Bezos. For 10 years, he studied Sam Walton's book Made in America. I've been studying this Benioff book for about 10 years.

DG: You've been studying this Benioff book, me too. Not 10 years.

David Cancel: Highlighted copy this, a couple of weeks.

DG: But maybe for a couple weeks. I actually still get pictures from that book. I love that book because it's all broken into plays.

David Cancel: Yes.

DG: He's like play number 42. So I don't know, DC will randomly text me out of the blue and be like," Play number 27."

David Cancel: Let's run it.

DG: This play. I'm like, that's not in the... He'll just send me numbers, but I love it. The name play is amazing.

David Cancel: Let's get it.

DG: Okay. There's two biographies. They're not in stacks, but there's two biographies. Steve Jobs biography, Elon Musk's biography. Love them both, enough said.

David Cancel: Enough said.

DG: You don't need to explain either.

David Cancel: Just read them.

DG: Just read them both. Interesting how much they have alike. A lot of founders like that.

David Cancel: In common.

DG: Built from Scratch.

David Cancel: Built from Scratch.

DG: Talk to me about it.

David Cancel: That's the story by Bernie Marcus and Arthur Blank about the founding of Home Depot. It's a new edition, recently new edition. It's an old book, but it's pretty new to the Drift library. What I love about it, and it goes along with the other two books that I love the most, is that it comes from this retail perspective. The story of Home Depot, if you don't know Home Depot, if you're not in the US, Home Depot is a massive global hardware store chain, a home improvement chain.

DG: Smells great in there too, I love the smell.

David Cancel: Smells like wood, sawn wood.

DG: You wouldn't expect that out of me, but-

David Cancel: I know, I know you're not handy.

DG: It's a nice smell.

David Cancel: I didn't think you knew what the Home Depot was.

DG: I'm not-

David Cancel: Leah took you.

DG: Leah asked me to go to Home Depot.

David Cancel: Your wife took you. Okay. That makes sense.

DG: I drive.

David Cancel: You drive, she picks out the tools. What's amazing is that they go through this approach, which is very common in the books that we like, of this servant leadership approach. This team focused on delivering customer value approach, and how that has been integral to the values and the integrity that they put behind the company, the Home Depot.

DG: One of my favorites, which how many companies do you know have this book in the lobby? This is a thick, expensive, fancy, hardcover book, Shoe Dog by Phil Knight.

David Cancel: Oh, Shoe Dog. There's my boy. Phil Knight, founder of Nike, OG, OG. This is a book, we did a podcast on it. I don't know what episode it is. The young nephew over here might find out which episode.

DG: I can find out.

David Cancel: There's a Seeking Wisdom episode that we did on this book, which is very popular, often referenced. Shoe Dog is this remarkable story of the founding of Nike. What's remarkable about this story is how detailed it goes into and how long of a journey it was for him to become an overnight success and to found Nike. Obviously not an overnight success, and how many times he came to the brink of that company disappearing. At the last minute, he was able to pull it through. That is one of those books, just like there's a few other business books that are like this. There aren't many that really paint a picture of what it's actually like to be an entrepreneur, how hard it is and how long it takes.

DG: 100%. I think, when I read that, obviously, you know Nike, had no idea that he started working on Nike in the 60s and 70s.

David Cancel: 60s.

DG: You would have never thought that.

David Cancel: Yeah, 60s.

DG: I was just Googling this because right now I'm reading the Tiger Woods, a book about Tiger Woods.

David Cancel: T Goody?

DG: He's pretty good. Yeah.

David Cancel: T Goody.

DG: He's good, T Goody, pretty good. So in the book, he's talking about Phil Knight, when Tiger was 19 years old, he was still an amateur, he was about to turn pro and he had Phil Knight, has this copywriter, his ads guy. He did the Michael Jordan commercials. He did all the Nike commercials.

David Cancel: You have my attention.

DG: He did all the Nike commercials.

David Cancel: Get that boy's number.

DG: He had the guy, Tiger has this amazing ad, it was called Hello World, which is like, they launch it the first day he turned pro. It's Hello World, it's this amazing montage of tiger as a kid all the years. The day before Tiger turned pro, he brought the copywriter in and he said," Play this ad for Tiger." Everybody in the room was just speechless, and they started crying because it was that good. That's how good this guy is.

David Cancel: Dude, man, you better take some lesson from him.

DG: It just reminded me because you hooked me up with that copywriting book last week. I'll look him up and return it to you.

David Cancel: Shh.

DG: I'm not going to tell you what it is.

David Cancel: Okay.

DG: No, no, I haven't even tweeted that one.

David Cancel: This top secret one.

DG: I haven't tweeted that one.

David Cancel: No one's on this stuff.

DG: Okay. We got three left, three left. One that we've never talked about.

David Cancel: What's that?

DG: Oprah.

David Cancel: Okay.

DG: What I Know for Sure.

David Cancel: Yeah. So we brought in an Oprah book here. We should do an episode on it.

DG: We should do that one.

David Cancel: First. We got to get the nephew to read it.

DG: First, I got to read it.

David Cancel: Yeah.

DG: I'll read it.

David Cancel: It's a small book, it's a thin book. But she's a lot like Phil Knight to me. Like Phil Knight, like Arnold, Schwarzenegger. Like all of these people that are able to come from nothing and reimagine the world the way that they want it.

DG: Can I say one other thing, by the way? I think a lot of people listening to this are in marketing or business. I think we often think who are great marketers? We think of marketers, but I think Oprah, amazing marketer.

David Cancel: Amazing marketer, next level.

DG: Phil Knight, amazing marketer.

David Cancel: Richard Branson.

DG: Richard Branson, Elon Musk, Steve Jobs.

David Cancel: Marketer, marketer.

DG: All of these people. None of them, nobody on paper gives them credit for being marketers. But all these amazing ones. Sorry, I'm pounding the table. I get excited.

David Cancel: He's getting excited, he's pounding.

DG: I'm getting excited. Actually this, Tony Robbins was on James Altucher's podcast and he's fired up. He's smashing the table all the time. So now I feel like that guy. So amazing marketer. All right. Principles, Ray Dalio.

David Cancel: Principles, a Ray Dalio book. Yeah. That's a recent addition we've had in the last year.

DG: Recent addition, pretty looking book too.

David Cancel: It only came out in the last year. Pretty book, thick book.

DG: Thick book.

David Cancel: The good thing about that book, I originally read that book as a PDF because you could download the PDF. It was an internal PDF and Ray Dalio, founder of Bridgewater, if not the biggest, one of the biggest hedge funds in the world. Also, I believe the homie's from Queens. He might be from Long island, but he's either Long Island or Queens.

DG: Hold on, I got to check. I'm going to check. I'm going to check.

David Cancel: Where's Ray Dalio from?

DG: I'm going to check. I see residence, that's because he's paid now.

David Cancel: He's from Queens.

DG: He's from New York, New York.

David Cancel: Okay.

DG: New York City, New York. Doesn't say the borough, but okay.

David Cancel: Okay. That's a Queens homie right there.

DG: Pretty good, pretty good.

David Cancel: So Ray Dalio wrote this book Principles slowly inside his company, Bridgewater, who have an unorthodox way of working internally. This was kind of like their employee handbook. Beyond handbook, it was him transferring the way that they make decisions. So then he recently published this, but this had been available as a bootleg. Taking you back in time. For you OGs, you know what bootlegs are.

DG: Bootlegs.

David Cancel: Like a bootleg that you could download on the internet.

DG: Picture a young DC on Canal Street picking up a bunch of bootlegs.

David Cancel: That's right, I was on Canal Street, picking up bootleg videos, bootleg CDs.

DG: So after Principles, we swipe something, and so for the marketing team at Drift, we wrote this deck called Marketing Principles.

David Cancel: Top secret.

DG: It's just how we do marketing. I will never share this one externally, but in it I pulled a quote from Ray Dalio from the book. He said," I just want to be right. I don't care if the right answer comes from me."

David Cancel: Amen.

DG: That's the whole mindset.

David Cancel: That's the mindset.

DG: So you don't have to read 600 pages. Okay. Last one, probably my favorite, Ogilvy on Advertising.

David Cancel: We've talked about this.

DG: Talked about it.

David Cancel: This is a great OG book. There's this book, but then there's the other one. The Confessions of an Ad Manager.

DG: I thought you were going to mention the secret- secret.

David Cancel: No, no, no, no. I never, no one's ever going to find that one. It's too deep. This is a great book, but I've come to appreciate even more than this book, the other one, which is The Confessions.

DG: Because I think Confessions is more of a writing. Ogilvy on Advertising to me is that's a swipe file. It's images. It's nice. It looks nice to have on my desk.

David Cancel: And you can go through it. Everyone who's in marketing and sales should have a copy of Ogilvy's book.

DG: If you're in sales and you are reading books like Benioff and Ogilvy-

David Cancel: You're next level.

DG: Assassin level.

David Cancel: You're going to be assassin level. Speaking of books, there's a book coming out.

DG: There is.

David Cancel: It's called Conversational Marketing. We're writing the book on conversational marketing.

DG: Yes.

David Cancel: What's the URL for that?

DG: Drift. com/ book.

David Cancel: Oh, okay. That's easy to remember.

DG: Simple.

David Cancel: Drift.com/ book. Sign up on there.

DG: This guy that I work with, beat me over the head with the simple stick.

David Cancel: Simple stick.

DG: Do Drift. com/ book.

David Cancel: Ooh, I like that. All right. So sign up, we're writing a book. We're writing it for Wiley and we're writing the definitive guide on conversational marketing, this new category.

DG: 60,000 words.

David Cancel: 60, 000 words. Holy, that's a lot of words.

DG: It's a lot of words.

David Cancel: I speak only Spanglish. So that's going to be hard.

DG: I know we are going to hire a translator to make the book available in all languages.

David Cancel: Sign up there to be notified first. We might have special gifts that we're giving away for people that sign up on there. This book is a love affair. Something that we're putting together, something that's going to reshape, as Mark Roberge wrote this, I don't know what it means. He's like," We might be defining the new S- curve in marketing."

DG: I saw that. I saw that. Mark's one of those guys that like, if he tweets it, I'm like, uh huh.

David Cancel: Yeah. Sounds right.

DG: I don't know what it means.

David Cancel: The new S curve in marketing. If you know what that means, tell us in the ratings. As you leave a six star rating, tell us what is the S- curve in marketing?

DG: What is the S-curve?

David Cancel: But it sounds good.

DG: Just in case you didn't hear him. We're writing the Conversational Marketing book. Okay. We put DC in a headlock. We said," Look, we got to tell the world the playbook." It's actually not. The book's not about Drift.

David Cancel: No.

DG: It's about something bigger.

David Cancel: Bigger, much bigger.

DG: The shift from supply to demand, right? How to compete in a world with infinite supply and why you need conversational marketing, not about Drift. But we're going to see more and more companies get in this space, so I think you've got to pick up a copy. But if you go to that, we promise you that you're going to get the book basically for free, the cheapest price we can get you on the internet.

David Cancel: Not only are companies coming in, they're already coming in, man. They're already trying to copy Conversational Marketing.

DG: Yeah, I've seen that.

David Cancel: They're already trying to.

DG: I've seen that.

David Cancel: I'm going to have to get my lawyer. Oh, I'm sorry. But anyway.

DG: We have good lawyers too.

David Cancel: We want to expand the conversational marketing world and we think of transforming marketing and sales. But important that you leave a six star review. I've been seeing some good six star reviews.

DG: I love those. That's my favorite. My favorite email I get is every Sunday morning, I get a forwarded email from DC to me with you have 17 new reviews for Seeking Wisdom. That's my favorite email.

David Cancel: I like them and they're all six star.

DG: That's my favorite email that I get. All right. I want to wrap up with one quote. Since we're talking about Drift and being in a new office and new stuff, I want to talk about something that Kevin Haverty, who is our newest board member at Drift. He's the EVP of worldwide sales at Service Now. Shout out to him. He said something about Service Now that we've kind of taken and you always take words from somebody else and it's kind of crystallized what we feel about Drift. He said about Service Now," Great people kill it here. Good people struggle. Average people fail." I think that's something that once he said that, it's like, this is something that we got to share more. But don't you feel like most people wouldn't say something like that about their company? Because it's going to turn a lot of people off?

David Cancel: Totally. But you want to. I loved when he said that and I know the ex CEO, his friend, Frank Slootman, I think that's where those words originated. It sounds like Frank Slootman.

DG: It does.

David Cancel: But I think it's amazing that he's saying that because what we need more of in the world, we're in a sensitive time right now in the world. What we need more of in this world is real people. No more fakeness, no more facades. In some ways, that's what our brand, that Drift is and what we're trying to do, and connecting people to people. Everything that we're doing within the podcasts, the videos, whatever we're doing, let's go back to being real people where we can say real things like that. Guess what? You don't have to be for everyone.

DG: No, you don't.

David Cancel: Not in a land of infinite supply.

DG: You don't because you can't be for everybody.

David Cancel: No, you can't be.

DG: By the way, it's easier to be real than to be fake. Right?

David Cancel: Much easier.

DG: Quote take from Patagonia, their founder, Yvon Chouinard said," It's easier to write non- fiction than it is to write fiction."

David Cancel: 100%. Something that we always talk about, which is look, you don't have to agree with everything that someone says. That would be a problem actually, if you agree with everything that someone says. What you have to learn how to do is be able to take the good lessons. Even when you disagree with someone, to still be civil and to have respect and to be able to work with that person and reach across the aisle to that person. That's the world I want to live in. So I was happy when Kevin said that because he was taking a stand about their company, about who would do a great job there? Who would love it?

DG: You translated that into something that you share with our team that we've been bringing into the hiring process more, which is... Do you remember your line about who Drift is for? He's like, no.

David Cancel: No. Which one of the lines?

DG: Drift, the whole story about-

David Cancel: Oh yeah. Yeah, I know, now I know.

DG: Drift is a great place.

David Cancel: I didn't know you were talking about hiring. But so basically what I said was Drift is a great place for people who know what they want. So if they know what they want, meaning they know that they want to get to this next level, what they want to achieve next. They have goals. They're driven about what they're doing. This is an amazing place. On the flip side, Drift is not a great place for people who don't know what they want. People that don't know what if they want to work or travel the world. Who want to be a juggler or be a marketer. Be an artist or be an engineer. If you don't know what you want in life, which is totally fine, then it's not the place because it's going to be, and I use this analogy, it'd be like," Hey, I'm into cycling, as recreationally, as you can tell from this physique."

DG: He busted my ass though. So I got nothing to say about it.

David Cancel: That's true. That's true. So mountain bike downhill. But if I spent all my time around elite athletes who are cyclists, that wouldn't be fun.

DG: No.

David Cancel: Because I'm not focused on what they want to do. That's not me. Same thing, you want to be around people who are like- minded and driven.

DG: Amen. All right. As we wrap up, let me tee you up for your Hypergrowth call to action. Because I got this tweet, we got this tweet this morning from Thomas Maremaa, shout out to you, Thomas. He goes," Hyper- growth tickets copped. Glad I picked up the Seeking Wisdom. Glad I picked up Seeking Wisdom for that sneaky promo code at the end. Thanks." Then somebody replied to him, Laris said," Nice, have you gone before? Is it worth it?" He said," I didn't attend last year, but just from following DC and DG for a bit, I think it's totally worth it. I'm sure the team is working hard to deliver."

David Cancel: Shout it out.

DG: So shout out to you, Thomas.

David Cancel: Let me just confirm, Thomas.

DG: Just confirm.

David Cancel: That they are working hard and sweating bullets over here. So shout out, Jana.

DG: Let me tell you something.

David Cancel: They're sweating some bullets in here.

DG: Bullets. It's a tall task.

David Cancel: We are going to drop. I'm not going to tell you when, but we are going to drop a whole, long list of amazing speakers. It's going to be like a bomb.

DG: A bomb. A good bomb.

David Cancel: A good bomb. You're going to want to be here. So we're hooking up the Hypergrowth. Sorry. The Seeking Wisdom community with Hypergrowth. And we're saying go register Hypergrowth. Drift. com, promo code, Seeking Wisdom, one word. Those would be the cheapest way that you can get tickets. Come hang with the Seeking Wisdom community. Come hang with the homies. Make sure when you show up that you've left a six star review.

DG: Make it easy for yourself. We're giving you a$ 500 break on the ticket. It's going to be 199, which I'm probably going to kill for somewhere on the back end when you look at the whole budget.

David Cancel: Yeah, he'll have to pay for that.

DG: But most people aren't paying out of pocket. That's an expense. It's a day of learning. You'll be able to make the case to your boss. This is going to be a day that you're going to invest all day.

David Cancel: It's in San Francisco and in Boston.

DG: Both.

David Cancel: In both.

DG: Yeah.

David Cancel: 1500 people in San Francisco, 4500 in Boston.

DG: Nice, good job.

David Cancel: See that?

DG: Good job. You didn't change the numbers.

David Cancel: I didn't change the numbers. They're here, they're carved in stone, pointing on my head. All right, everyone it's been real. Don't forget. Hang with the uncle and the young nephew, aka DG, aka DD now.

DG: Damn.

David Cancel: Come hang with us and you'll get to meet G2, the new secret weapon.

DG: The new secret weapon. See you.

David Cancel: Peace.

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